Comments on: Jewelry 101: Pickle http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/ All about jewelry and creativity Wed, 17 Aug 2011 18:45:22 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.1 By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83385 Leah Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:58:00 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83385 Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn't know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves. Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn’t know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves.

]]> By: Andrew http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83382 Andrew Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:01:15 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83382 <b>Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.</b> <b>1. Heat Quenching</b> <b> Raevyn</b> I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing. Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn't shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same). This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you've bent back and forth a few too many times. <b>2. Excess Pickling</b> As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there's also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve. <blockquote>Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant) Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) --> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l ) Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.</blockquote> So... If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid "ate" all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium. <b>JH</b> if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated). Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.
1. Heat Quenching
Raevyn I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing.
Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn’t shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same).
This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you’ve bent back and forth a few too many times.

2. Excess Pickling
As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there’s also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve.

Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant)
Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) –> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l )
Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.

So… If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid “ate” all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium.
JH if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated).

]]> By: Scott http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-78880 Scott Tue, 08 Feb 2011 02:54:56 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-78880 I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven't really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest. As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn't be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder. I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven’t really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest.

As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn’t be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder.

]]> By: Raevyn http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-58521 Raevyn Thu, 09 Sep 2010 20:07:35 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-58521 Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium...works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it's because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away...the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of "burning" pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle. Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium…works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it’s because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away…the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of “burning” pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle.

]]> By: Jewelry Making Supplies http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-49350 Jewelry Making Supplies Fri, 07 May 2010 20:54:32 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-49350 I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts! I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts!

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42986 Leah Wed, 09 Dec 2009 17:54:59 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42986 Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by. Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by.

]]> By: Kristin http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42940 Kristin Tue, 08 Dec 2009 20:50:20 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42940 Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today...I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness! Kristin Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today…I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness!

Kristin

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41895 Leah Wed, 18 Nov 2009 23:31:23 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41895 Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :) Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :)

]]> By: Jim http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41807 Jim Tue, 17 Nov 2009 01:43:48 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41807 Hi again! My experiences are similar - I've damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I'm usually using harder stones, so I'll keep tumbling away. Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks! Jim Hi again!
My experiences are similar – I’ve damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I’m usually using harder stones, so I’ll keep tumbling away.
Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks!
Jim

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/ All about jewelry and creativity Wed, 17 Aug 2011 18:45:22 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.1 Comments on: Jewelry 101: Pickle http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/ All about jewelry and creativity Wed, 17 Aug 2011 18:45:22 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.1 By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83385 Leah Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:58:00 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83385 Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn't know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves. Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn’t know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves.

]]> By: Andrew http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83382 Andrew Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:01:15 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83382 <b>Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.</b> <b>1. Heat Quenching</b> <b> Raevyn</b> I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing. Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn't shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same). This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you've bent back and forth a few too many times. <b>2. Excess Pickling</b> As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there's also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve. <blockquote>Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant) Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) --> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l ) Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.</blockquote> So... If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid "ate" all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium. <b>JH</b> if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated). Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.
1. Heat Quenching
Raevyn I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing.
Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn’t shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same).
This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you’ve bent back and forth a few too many times.

2. Excess Pickling
As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there’s also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve.

Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant)
Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) –> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l )
Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.

So… If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid “ate” all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium.
JH if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated).

]]> By: Scott http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-78880 Scott Tue, 08 Feb 2011 02:54:56 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-78880 I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven't really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest. As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn't be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder. I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven’t really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest.

As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn’t be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder.

]]> By: Raevyn http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-58521 Raevyn Thu, 09 Sep 2010 20:07:35 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-58521 Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium...works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it's because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away...the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of "burning" pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle. Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium…works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it’s because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away…the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of “burning” pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle.

]]> By: Jewelry Making Supplies http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-49350 Jewelry Making Supplies Fri, 07 May 2010 20:54:32 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-49350 I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts! I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts!

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42986 Leah Wed, 09 Dec 2009 17:54:59 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42986 Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by. Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by.

]]> By: Kristin http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42940 Kristin Tue, 08 Dec 2009 20:50:20 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42940 Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today...I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness! Kristin Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today…I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness!

Kristin

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41895 Leah Wed, 18 Nov 2009 23:31:23 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41895 Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :) Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :)

]]> By: Jim http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41807 Jim Tue, 17 Nov 2009 01:43:48 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41807 Hi again! My experiences are similar - I've damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I'm usually using harder stones, so I'll keep tumbling away. Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks! Jim Hi again!
My experiences are similar – I’ve damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I’m usually using harder stones, so I’ll keep tumbling away.
Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks!
Jim

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83385 Leah Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:58:00 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83385 Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn't know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves. Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn’t know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves.

]]> Comments on: Jewelry 101: Pickle http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/ All about jewelry and creativity Wed, 17 Aug 2011 18:45:22 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.1 By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83385 Leah Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:58:00 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83385 Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn't know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves. Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn’t know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves.

]]> By: Andrew http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83382 Andrew Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:01:15 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83382 <b>Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.</b> <b>1. Heat Quenching</b> <b> Raevyn</b> I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing. Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn't shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same). This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you've bent back and forth a few too many times. <b>2. Excess Pickling</b> As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there's also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve. <blockquote>Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant) Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) --> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l ) Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.</blockquote> So... If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid "ate" all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium. <b>JH</b> if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated). Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.
1. Heat Quenching
Raevyn I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing.
Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn’t shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same).
This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you’ve bent back and forth a few too many times.

2. Excess Pickling
As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there’s also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve.

Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant)
Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) –> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l )
Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.

So… If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid “ate” all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium.
JH if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated).

]]> By: Scott http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-78880 Scott Tue, 08 Feb 2011 02:54:56 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-78880 I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven't really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest. As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn't be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder. I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven’t really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest.

As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn’t be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder.

]]> By: Raevyn http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-58521 Raevyn Thu, 09 Sep 2010 20:07:35 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-58521 Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium...works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it's because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away...the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of "burning" pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle. Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium…works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it’s because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away…the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of “burning” pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle.

]]> By: Jewelry Making Supplies http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-49350 Jewelry Making Supplies Fri, 07 May 2010 20:54:32 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-49350 I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts! I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts!

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42986 Leah Wed, 09 Dec 2009 17:54:59 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42986 Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by. Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by.

]]> By: Kristin http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42940 Kristin Tue, 08 Dec 2009 20:50:20 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42940 Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today...I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness! Kristin Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today…I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness!

Kristin

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41895 Leah Wed, 18 Nov 2009 23:31:23 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41895 Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :) Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :)

]]> By: Jim http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41807 Jim Tue, 17 Nov 2009 01:43:48 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41807 Hi again! My experiences are similar - I've damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I'm usually using harder stones, so I'll keep tumbling away. Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks! Jim Hi again!
My experiences are similar – I’ve damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I’m usually using harder stones, so I’ll keep tumbling away.
Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks!
Jim

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83382 Andrew Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:01:15 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83382 <b>Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.</b> <b>1. Heat Quenching</b> <b> Raevyn</b> I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing. Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn't shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same). This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you've bent back and forth a few too many times. <b>2. Excess Pickling</b> As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there's also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve. <blockquote>Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant) Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) --> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l ) Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.</blockquote> So... If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid "ate" all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium. <b>JH</b> if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated). Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.
1. Heat Quenching
Raevyn I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing.
Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn’t shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same).
This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you’ve bent back and forth a few too many times.

2. Excess Pickling
As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there’s also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve.

Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant)
Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) –> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l )
Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.

So… If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid “ate” all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium.
JH if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated).

]]> Comments on: Jewelry 101: Pickle http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/ All about jewelry and creativity Wed, 17 Aug 2011 18:45:22 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.1 By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83385 Leah Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:58:00 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83385 Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn't know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves. Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn’t know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves.

]]> By: Andrew http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83382 Andrew Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:01:15 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83382 <b>Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.</b> <b>1. Heat Quenching</b> <b> Raevyn</b> I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing. Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn't shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same). This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you've bent back and forth a few too many times. <b>2. Excess Pickling</b> As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there's also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve. <blockquote>Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant) Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) --> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l ) Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.</blockquote> So... If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid "ate" all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium. <b>JH</b> if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated). Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.
1. Heat Quenching
Raevyn I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing.
Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn’t shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same).
This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you’ve bent back and forth a few too many times.

2. Excess Pickling
As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there’s also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve.

Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant)
Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) –> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l )
Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.

So… If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid “ate” all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium.
JH if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated).

]]> By: Scott http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-78880 Scott Tue, 08 Feb 2011 02:54:56 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-78880 I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven't really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest. As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn't be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder. I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven’t really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest.

As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn’t be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder.

]]> By: Raevyn http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-58521 Raevyn Thu, 09 Sep 2010 20:07:35 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-58521 Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium...works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it's because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away...the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of "burning" pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle. Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium…works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it’s because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away…the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of “burning” pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle.

]]> By: Jewelry Making Supplies http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-49350 Jewelry Making Supplies Fri, 07 May 2010 20:54:32 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-49350 I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts! I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts!

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42986 Leah Wed, 09 Dec 2009 17:54:59 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42986 Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by. Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by.

]]> By: Kristin http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42940 Kristin Tue, 08 Dec 2009 20:50:20 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42940 Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today...I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness! Kristin Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today…I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness!

Kristin

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41895 Leah Wed, 18 Nov 2009 23:31:23 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41895 Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :) Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :)

]]> By: Jim http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41807 Jim Tue, 17 Nov 2009 01:43:48 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41807 Hi again! My experiences are similar - I've damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I'm usually using harder stones, so I'll keep tumbling away. Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks! Jim Hi again!
My experiences are similar – I’ve damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I’m usually using harder stones, so I’ll keep tumbling away.
Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks!
Jim

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-78880 Scott Tue, 08 Feb 2011 02:54:56 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-78880 I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven't really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest. As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn't be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder. I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven’t really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest.

As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn’t be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder.

]]> Comments on: Jewelry 101: Pickle http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/ All about jewelry and creativity Wed, 17 Aug 2011 18:45:22 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.1 By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83385 Leah Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:58:00 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83385 Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn't know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves. Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn’t know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves.

]]> By: Andrew http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83382 Andrew Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:01:15 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83382 <b>Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.</b> <b>1. Heat Quenching</b> <b> Raevyn</b> I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing. Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn't shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same). This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you've bent back and forth a few too many times. <b>2. Excess Pickling</b> As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there's also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve. <blockquote>Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant) Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) --> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l ) Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.</blockquote> So... If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid "ate" all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium. <b>JH</b> if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated). Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.
1. Heat Quenching
Raevyn I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing.
Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn’t shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same).
This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you’ve bent back and forth a few too many times.

2. Excess Pickling
As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there’s also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve.

Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant)
Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) –> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l )
Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.

So… If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid “ate” all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium.
JH if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated).

]]> By: Scott http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-78880 Scott Tue, 08 Feb 2011 02:54:56 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-78880 I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven't really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest. As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn't be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder. I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven’t really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest.

As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn’t be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder.

]]> By: Raevyn http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-58521 Raevyn Thu, 09 Sep 2010 20:07:35 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-58521 Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium...works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it's because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away...the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of "burning" pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle. Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium…works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it’s because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away…the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of “burning” pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle.

]]> By: Jewelry Making Supplies http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-49350 Jewelry Making Supplies Fri, 07 May 2010 20:54:32 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-49350 I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts! I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts!

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42986 Leah Wed, 09 Dec 2009 17:54:59 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42986 Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by. Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by.

]]> By: Kristin http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42940 Kristin Tue, 08 Dec 2009 20:50:20 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42940 Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today...I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness! Kristin Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today…I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness!

Kristin

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41895 Leah Wed, 18 Nov 2009 23:31:23 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41895 Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :) Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :)

]]> By: Jim http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41807 Jim Tue, 17 Nov 2009 01:43:48 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41807 Hi again! My experiences are similar - I've damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I'm usually using harder stones, so I'll keep tumbling away. Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks! Jim Hi again!
My experiences are similar – I’ve damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I’m usually using harder stones, so I’ll keep tumbling away.
Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks!
Jim

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-58521 Raevyn Thu, 09 Sep 2010 20:07:35 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-58521 Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium...works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it's because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away...the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of "burning" pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle. Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium…works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it’s because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away…the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of “burning” pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle.

]]> Comments on: Jewelry 101: Pickle http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/ All about jewelry and creativity Wed, 17 Aug 2011 18:45:22 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.1 By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83385 Leah Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:58:00 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83385 Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn't know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves. Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn’t know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves.

]]> By: Andrew http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83382 Andrew Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:01:15 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83382 <b>Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.</b> <b>1. Heat Quenching</b> <b> Raevyn</b> I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing. Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn't shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same). This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you've bent back and forth a few too many times. <b>2. Excess Pickling</b> As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there's also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve. <blockquote>Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant) Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) --> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l ) Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.</blockquote> So... If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid "ate" all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium. <b>JH</b> if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated). Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.
1. Heat Quenching
Raevyn I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing.
Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn’t shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same).
This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you’ve bent back and forth a few too many times.

2. Excess Pickling
As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there’s also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve.

Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant)
Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) –> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l )
Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.

So… If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid “ate” all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium.
JH if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated).

]]> By: Scott http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-78880 Scott Tue, 08 Feb 2011 02:54:56 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-78880 I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven't really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest. As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn't be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder. I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven’t really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest.

As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn’t be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder.

]]> By: Raevyn http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-58521 Raevyn Thu, 09 Sep 2010 20:07:35 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-58521 Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium...works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it's because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away...the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of "burning" pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle. Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium…works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it’s because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away…the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of “burning” pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle.

]]> By: Jewelry Making Supplies http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-49350 Jewelry Making Supplies Fri, 07 May 2010 20:54:32 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-49350 I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts! I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts!

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42986 Leah Wed, 09 Dec 2009 17:54:59 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42986 Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by. Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by.

]]> By: Kristin http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42940 Kristin Tue, 08 Dec 2009 20:50:20 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42940 Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today...I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness! Kristin Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today…I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness!

Kristin

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41895 Leah Wed, 18 Nov 2009 23:31:23 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41895 Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :) Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :)

]]> By: Jim http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41807 Jim Tue, 17 Nov 2009 01:43:48 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41807 Hi again! My experiences are similar - I've damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I'm usually using harder stones, so I'll keep tumbling away. Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks! Jim Hi again!
My experiences are similar – I’ve damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I’m usually using harder stones, so I’ll keep tumbling away.
Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks!
Jim

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-49350 Jewelry Making Supplies Fri, 07 May 2010 20:54:32 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-49350 I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts! I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts!

]]> Comments on: Jewelry 101: Pickle http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/ All about jewelry and creativity Wed, 17 Aug 2011 18:45:22 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.1 By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83385 Leah Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:58:00 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83385 Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn't know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves. Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn’t know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves.

]]> By: Andrew http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83382 Andrew Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:01:15 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83382 <b>Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.</b> <b>1. Heat Quenching</b> <b> Raevyn</b> I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing. Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn't shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same). This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you've bent back and forth a few too many times. <b>2. Excess Pickling</b> As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there's also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve. <blockquote>Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant) Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) --> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l ) Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.</blockquote> So... If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid "ate" all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium. <b>JH</b> if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated). Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.
1. Heat Quenching
Raevyn I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing.
Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn’t shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same).
This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you’ve bent back and forth a few too many times.

2. Excess Pickling
As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there’s also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve.

Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant)
Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) –> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l )
Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.

So… If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid “ate” all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium.
JH if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated).

]]> By: Scott http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-78880 Scott Tue, 08 Feb 2011 02:54:56 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-78880 I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven't really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest. As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn't be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder. I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven’t really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest.

As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn’t be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder.

]]> By: Raevyn http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-58521 Raevyn Thu, 09 Sep 2010 20:07:35 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-58521 Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium...works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it's because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away...the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of "burning" pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle. Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium…works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it’s because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away…the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of “burning” pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle.

]]> By: Jewelry Making Supplies http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-49350 Jewelry Making Supplies Fri, 07 May 2010 20:54:32 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-49350 I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts! I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts!

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42986 Leah Wed, 09 Dec 2009 17:54:59 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42986 Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by. Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by.

]]> By: Kristin http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42940 Kristin Tue, 08 Dec 2009 20:50:20 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42940 Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today...I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness! Kristin Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today…I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness!

Kristin

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41895 Leah Wed, 18 Nov 2009 23:31:23 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41895 Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :) Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :)

]]> By: Jim http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41807 Jim Tue, 17 Nov 2009 01:43:48 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41807 Hi again! My experiences are similar - I've damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I'm usually using harder stones, so I'll keep tumbling away. Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks! Jim Hi again!
My experiences are similar – I’ve damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I’m usually using harder stones, so I’ll keep tumbling away.
Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks!
Jim

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42986 Leah Wed, 09 Dec 2009 17:54:59 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42986 Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by. Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by.

]]> Comments on: Jewelry 101: Pickle http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/ All about jewelry and creativity Wed, 17 Aug 2011 18:45:22 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.1 By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83385 Leah Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:58:00 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83385 Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn't know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves. Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn’t know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves.

]]> By: Andrew http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83382 Andrew Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:01:15 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83382 <b>Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.</b> <b>1. Heat Quenching</b> <b> Raevyn</b> I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing. Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn't shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same). This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you've bent back and forth a few too many times. <b>2. Excess Pickling</b> As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there's also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve. <blockquote>Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant) Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) --> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l ) Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.</blockquote> So... If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid "ate" all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium. <b>JH</b> if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated). Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.
1. Heat Quenching
Raevyn I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing.
Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn’t shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same).
This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you’ve bent back and forth a few too many times.

2. Excess Pickling
As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there’s also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve.

Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant)
Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) –> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l )
Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.

So… If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid “ate” all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium.
JH if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated).

]]> By: Scott http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-78880 Scott Tue, 08 Feb 2011 02:54:56 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-78880 I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven't really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest. As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn't be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder. I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven’t really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest.

As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn’t be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder.

]]> By: Raevyn http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-58521 Raevyn Thu, 09 Sep 2010 20:07:35 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-58521 Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium...works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it's because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away...the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of "burning" pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle. Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium…works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it’s because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away…the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of “burning” pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle.

]]> By: Jewelry Making Supplies http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-49350 Jewelry Making Supplies Fri, 07 May 2010 20:54:32 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-49350 I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts! I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts!

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42986 Leah Wed, 09 Dec 2009 17:54:59 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42986 Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by. Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by.

]]> By: Kristin http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42940 Kristin Tue, 08 Dec 2009 20:50:20 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42940 Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today...I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness! Kristin Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today…I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness!

Kristin

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41895 Leah Wed, 18 Nov 2009 23:31:23 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41895 Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :) Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :)

]]> By: Jim http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41807 Jim Tue, 17 Nov 2009 01:43:48 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41807 Hi again! My experiences are similar - I've damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I'm usually using harder stones, so I'll keep tumbling away. Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks! Jim Hi again!
My experiences are similar – I’ve damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I’m usually using harder stones, so I’ll keep tumbling away.
Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks!
Jim

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42940 Kristin Tue, 08 Dec 2009 20:50:20 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42940 Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today...I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness! Kristin Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today…I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness!

Kristin

]]> Comments on: Jewelry 101: Pickle http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/ All about jewelry and creativity Wed, 17 Aug 2011 18:45:22 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.1 By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83385 Leah Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:58:00 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83385 Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn't know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves. Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn’t know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves.

]]> By: Andrew http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83382 Andrew Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:01:15 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83382 <b>Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.</b> <b>1. Heat Quenching</b> <b> Raevyn</b> I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing. Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn't shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same). This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you've bent back and forth a few too many times. <b>2. Excess Pickling</b> As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there's also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve. <blockquote>Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant) Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) --> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l ) Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.</blockquote> So... If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid "ate" all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium. <b>JH</b> if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated). Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.
1. Heat Quenching
Raevyn I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing.
Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn’t shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same).
This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you’ve bent back and forth a few too many times.

2. Excess Pickling
As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there’s also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve.

Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant)
Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) –> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l )
Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.

So… If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid “ate” all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium.
JH if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated).

]]> By: Scott http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-78880 Scott Tue, 08 Feb 2011 02:54:56 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-78880 I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven't really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest. As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn't be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder. I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven’t really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest.

As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn’t be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder.

]]> By: Raevyn http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-58521 Raevyn Thu, 09 Sep 2010 20:07:35 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-58521 Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium...works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it's because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away...the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of "burning" pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle. Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium…works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it’s because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away…the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of “burning” pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle.

]]> By: Jewelry Making Supplies http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-49350 Jewelry Making Supplies Fri, 07 May 2010 20:54:32 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-49350 I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts! I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts!

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42986 Leah Wed, 09 Dec 2009 17:54:59 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42986 Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by. Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by.

]]> By: Kristin http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42940 Kristin Tue, 08 Dec 2009 20:50:20 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42940 Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today...I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness! Kristin Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today…I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness!

Kristin

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41895 Leah Wed, 18 Nov 2009 23:31:23 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41895 Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :) Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :)

]]> By: Jim http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41807 Jim Tue, 17 Nov 2009 01:43:48 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41807 Hi again! My experiences are similar - I've damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I'm usually using harder stones, so I'll keep tumbling away. Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks! Jim Hi again!
My experiences are similar – I’ve damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I’m usually using harder stones, so I’ll keep tumbling away.
Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks!
Jim

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41895 Leah Wed, 18 Nov 2009 23:31:23 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41895 Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :) Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :)

]]> Comments on: Jewelry 101: Pickle http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/ All about jewelry and creativity Wed, 17 Aug 2011 18:45:22 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.1 By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83385 Leah Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:58:00 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83385 Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn't know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves. Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn’t know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves.

]]> By: Andrew http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83382 Andrew Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:01:15 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83382 <b>Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.</b> <b>1. Heat Quenching</b> <b> Raevyn</b> I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing. Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn't shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same). This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you've bent back and forth a few too many times. <b>2. Excess Pickling</b> As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there's also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve. <blockquote>Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant) Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) --> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l ) Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.</blockquote> So... If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid "ate" all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium. <b>JH</b> if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated). Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.
1. Heat Quenching
Raevyn I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing.
Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn’t shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same).
This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you’ve bent back and forth a few too many times.

2. Excess Pickling
As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there’s also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve.

Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant)
Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) –> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l )
Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.

So… If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid “ate” all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium.
JH if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated).

]]> By: Scott http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-78880 Scott Tue, 08 Feb 2011 02:54:56 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-78880 I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven't really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest. As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn't be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder. I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven’t really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest.

As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn’t be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder.

]]> By: Raevyn http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-58521 Raevyn Thu, 09 Sep 2010 20:07:35 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-58521 Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium...works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it's because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away...the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of "burning" pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle. Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium…works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it’s because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away…the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of “burning” pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle.

]]> By: Jewelry Making Supplies http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-49350 Jewelry Making Supplies Fri, 07 May 2010 20:54:32 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-49350 I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts! I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts!

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42986 Leah Wed, 09 Dec 2009 17:54:59 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42986 Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by. Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by.

]]> By: Kristin http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42940 Kristin Tue, 08 Dec 2009 20:50:20 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42940 Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today...I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness! Kristin Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today…I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness!

Kristin

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41895 Leah Wed, 18 Nov 2009 23:31:23 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41895 Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :) Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :)

]]> By: Jim http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41807 Jim Tue, 17 Nov 2009 01:43:48 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41807 Hi again! My experiences are similar - I've damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I'm usually using harder stones, so I'll keep tumbling away. Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks! Jim Hi again!
My experiences are similar – I’ve damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I’m usually using harder stones, so I’ll keep tumbling away.
Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks!
Jim

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41807 Jim Tue, 17 Nov 2009 01:43:48 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41807 Hi again! My experiences are similar - I've damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I'm usually using harder stones, so I'll keep tumbling away. Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks! Jim Hi again!
My experiences are similar – I’ve damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I’m usually using harder stones, so I’ll keep tumbling away.
Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks!
Jim

]]> Comments on: Jewelry 101: Pickle http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/ All about jewelry and creativity Wed, 17 Aug 2011 18:45:22 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.1 By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83385 Leah Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:58:00 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83385 Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn't know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves. Thanks for the in-depth reply! I didn’t know it was the zinc in solder that dissolves.

]]> By: Andrew http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-83382 Andrew Wed, 30 Mar 2011 15:01:15 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-83382 <b>Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.</b> <b>1. Heat Quenching</b> <b> Raevyn</b> I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing. Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn't shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same). This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you've bent back and forth a few too many times. <b>2. Excess Pickling</b> As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there's also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve. <blockquote>Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant) Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) --> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l ) Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.</blockquote> So... If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid "ate" all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium. <b>JH</b> if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated). Two things: In depth responses to heat quenching and excess pickling.
1. Heat Quenching
Raevyn I think you have the softening metal thing backwards. If you allow your metals to air cool they end up softer than if you drop them in your pickle or H2O first. The principle is the same as work hardening and annealing.
Just like glass; metals should be cooled slowly so that they are stronger, more malleable (softer), and more ductile. This is bc giving the hot (excited and vibrating) metal atoms time to slow and align makes for a more resilient atomic structure. Flash cooling whether in water or pickle makes your metal more brittle b/c its atomic structure is frozen in a less than optimal arrangement. (It doesn’t shatter like quickly cooled glass b/c metals are intrinsically more maleable and able to with stand heat and hammer but the principle is basically the same).
This is the principle behind annealing anything that has been overly work-hardened like mokume gane billet or just wire you’ve bent back and forth a few too many times.

2. Excess Pickling
As I am sure everyone is aware silver solder, argentium and sterling silver are not 100% silver. Copper(Cu) makes up a big part of the remainder and in solder there’s also Zinc(Zn). Zn is very soluble in acid and Cu is soluble also but it takes time to dissolve.

Example:Solid Cu in Sulfuric Acid (H2SO4) (the rxn is similar for any acid: type is irrelevant)
Cu(s ) + 4 H+(aq ) + SO42-(aq ) –> Cu2+(aq ) + SO2(g ) + 2 H2O(l )
Acidic hydrogens (H+) steal electrons from the Cu and pull Oxygen from the sulfate(SO42-) producing H2O, soluble Cu2+, and Sulfur Dioxide.

So… If you left a soldered piece in pickle for a week, after the acid “ate” all the readily available oxygen in the silver oxide it would probably start dissolving the Zn in the Solder, then the Cu in the Solder then eventually the Cu in the Sterling or Argentium.
JH if left long enough your pickle would be ever so slightly blue. Additionally your solders integrity would be compromised, the pickle having disolved 20%(hard solder) to 40%(soft) of its make up and not simply the flux as another post implied. Your silver would probably be ok if anything a little more pure having some of its Cu dissolved, but it should probably be annealed (heated).

]]> By: Scott http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-78880 Scott Tue, 08 Feb 2011 02:54:56 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-78880 I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven't really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest. As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn't be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder. I will almost always quench any silver items in pickle as it seems to do a better job in knocking off the deeper oxidation. I haven’t really seen any benefit or issue with doing it with gold, so I usually just quench that in whatever is closest.

As far as the pickle dissolving solder, it may seem rather far fetched, but seeing as pickle is an acid (and depending on how you mix it/what you use, a fairly strong one), I wouldn’t be surprised to find that, over time, it dissolves solder.

]]> By: Raevyn http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-58521 Raevyn Thu, 09 Sep 2010 20:07:35 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-58521 Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium...works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it's because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away...the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of "burning" pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle. Just a couple of notes: I do pickle my argentium…works just fine. Pickle will not dissolve a solder join. If things come apart in the pickle it’s because the flux was the only thing holding the solder join together and the pickle has melted the flux away…the solder never got to flow-point. I have never heard of “burning” pickle and always drop directly into the pickle from soldering. This can soften the metal a little and you can air-cool if you want to avoid that, but there is no other reason to wait before dropping things into the pickle.

]]> By: Jewelry Making Supplies http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-49350 Jewelry Making Supplies Fri, 07 May 2010 20:54:32 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-49350 I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts! I found your site on del.icio.us this morning and really liked it. I bookmarked your blog and will definitely be back soon to read your new posts!

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42986 Leah Wed, 09 Dec 2009 17:54:59 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42986 Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by. Thanks Kristin! Glad you stopped by.

]]> By: Kristin http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-42940 Kristin Tue, 08 Dec 2009 20:50:20 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-42940 Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today...I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness! Kristin Great info, I love that you answer your comments so well! I got here while googling to figure out if it was ok that I left some stuff in pickle before I went to work today…I guess if someone did it for a week, it will be ok until I get home!! :) Thanks so much for sharing the info, and your helpfulness!

Kristin

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41895 Leah Wed, 18 Nov 2009 23:31:23 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41895 Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :) Thanks for writing, Jim! I love getting good relevant comments on my blog :)

]]> By: Jim http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41807 Jim Tue, 17 Nov 2009 01:43:48 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41807 Hi again! My experiences are similar - I've damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I'm usually using harder stones, so I'll keep tumbling away. Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks! Jim Hi again!
My experiences are similar – I’ve damaged more stones with heat than I have in the tumbler. I’m usually using harder stones, so I’ll keep tumbling away.
Thanks again for taking the time to respond. I definitely appreciate your blog and your responses! Thanks thanks!
Jim

]]> By: Leah http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/comment-page-1/#comment-41806 Leah Tue, 17 Nov 2009 00:23:27 +0000 http://www.michondesign.com/jewelry-blog/index.php/2007/09/06/jewelry-101-pickle/#comment-41806 I usually try to tumble before adding stones or beads - just in case, since some stones like turquoise, and pearls, can be damaged by the tumbler. I have tumbled silver with glass and harder stones, and maybe I was lucky, but no damage was done. I've heard of people tumbling pearls, even, but it seems risky to me. I usually try to tumble before adding stones or beads – just in case, since some stones like turquoise, and pearls, can be damaged by the tumbler. I have tumbled silver with glass and harder stones, and maybe I was lucky, but no damage was done. I’ve heard of people tumbling pearls, even, but it seems risky to me.

]]>